Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

full

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by full » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 00:18:21

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota
Mon September 01, 2003 07:04 AM ET

TOKYO (Reuters) - A car that can park itself without the driver having
to touch the steering wheel, said by maker Toyota Motor Corp. to be a
world first, went on sale in Japan on Monday.

Toyota's new hybrid gasoline-electric Prius sedan uses electrically
operated power steering and sensors that help guide the car when
reversing into parking spaces.

Toyota President Fujio Cho sat in the driver's seat at a demonstration
laid on for the press, surprising reporters by holding his hands up as
the car quickly parked itself.

"I forgot to put on the brake," Cho said. "But it's easy."

The new Prius five-seat passenger model is said by Toyota to be more
fuel-efficient and cheaper than its predecessors. Rivals General
Motors Corp and Ford Motor Co will launch their first hybrids later
this year.

Toyota said it expects to sell 76,000 new Prius worldwide in 2004,
counting on growing demand for environment-friendly cars.

The sales target is more than double the annual figure for the Prius
for the past two years of around 28,000 units. Toyota, the world's
third-largest auto maker, has sold about 120,000 of the cars since its
launch in December 1997.

"Development of eco-friendly cars is a key to our future growth
strategy," Cho told reporters.

Toyota aims to sell 36,000 units at home, 35,000-36,000 in the United
States and 4,000-5,000 in rest of the world next year, he said.

The new model sells for 2.15 million yen ($18,430) in Japan, against
2.18 million yen previously. The intelligent park assist system is
offered as an option, at an additional cost of 230,000 yen which
includes a DVD navigation system. Toyota has set itself a goal of
producing 300,000 of the eco-friendly hybrid vehicles a year by 2005
or 2006.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pahsons - Somnolen

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Pahsons - Somnolen » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 00:41:14

Falling asleep through fuller's post...

God, my wife needs that

--
"If you can't change a tire, you're not allowed to have a beard.  It's the
most basic part of a car: If you don't know that much about a car, you
really shouldn't be driving, should you?" - Jimmy Kimmel
ntlhell rolls a six... deathwind is disembowelled with a chainsaw, run over
with a rhino, fed to the fish and his computer taken away from him such
that he doesn't bore us with that inane rot ever again. - ntlhell - A.G.G-
T-A http://www.cafeshops.com/creexul.2534632

Philip

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Philip » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 01:21:03


> Falling asleep through fuller's post...

>> Toyota's new hybrid gasoline-electric Prius sedan uses
>> electrically operated power steering and sensors that help guide
>> the car when reversing into parking spaces.

>> Toyota President Fujio Cho sat in the driver's seat at a
>> demonstration laid on for the press, surprising reporters by
>> holding his hands up as the car quickly parked itself.

>> "I forgot to put on the brake," Cho said. "But it's easy."

> God, my wife needs that

My wife learned how to parallel park using a small Massey Ferguson
tractor.  Once she got it in her head what to line up with, what to
aim for, and when to turn the wheel, she could spot anything.... even
a conventional with a 53' trailer.
--

   ~~Philip

"Never let school interfere
  with your education - Mark Twain"

Joseph Oberlande

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Joseph Oberlande » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 02:43:58


> The new Prius five-seat passenger model is said by Toyota to be more
> fuel-efficient and cheaper than its predecessors. Rivals General
> Motors Corp and Ford Motor Co will launch their first hybrids later
> this year.

Lol.  Let's see - a Taurus or Coutour with a hybrid engine rushed
and slapped into the chassis - exactly like the Honda "hybrid".  Ack.

GM - nuff said.  Their EV-1 was a disaster.  Independant people
had been converting normal Escorts and Metros to full electric
for a decade or more and getting better speed and range - for
less money.   (shakes head) Boggles your mind how badly they
messed up - almost as if they were trying to make a hopelessly
lowest common denominator vehicle to please some government requirement.

Note - I have links somewhere to a Honda hatchback that was converted
for $30K and got a 250 mile range - back in the mid 90s.  Standard
little CR-X with some weight reduction and NI-MH batteries.  Nothing
purpose-built.

To me? - the new Prius looks nice.  Wait 2-3 years and get a nice one
for the price of a stripped Echo.  No kludge, either - a ground-up
design made to squeeze out every bit of performance and efficiency.

No way anything kludged together by Ford or GM is going to compete.

Neat toy. :)  $2000 is a bit steep, though.

Nathan Nage

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Nathan Nage » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 02:46:10



> > The new Prius five-seat passenger model is said by Toyota to be more
> > fuel-efficient and cheaper than its predecessors. Rivals General
> > Motors Corp and Ford Motor Co will launch their first hybrids later
> > this year.

> Lol.  Let's see - a Taurus or Coutour with a hybrid engine rushed
> and slapped into the chassis - exactly like the Honda "hybrid".  Ack.

> GM - nuff said.  Their EV-1 was a disaster.  Independant people
> had been converting normal Escorts and Metros to full electric
> for a decade or more and getting better speed and range - for
> less money.   (shakes head) Boggles your mind how badly they
> messed up - almost as if they were trying to make a hopelessly
> lowest common denominator vehicle to please some government requirement.

> Note - I have links somewhere to a Honda hatchback that was converted
> for $30K and got a 250 mile range - back in the mid 90s.  Standard
> little CR-X with some weight reduction and NI-MH batteries.  Nothing
> purpose-built.

> To me? - the new Prius looks nice.  Wait 2-3 years and get a nice one
> for the price of a stripped Echo.  No kludge, either - a ground-up
> design made to squeeze out every bit of performance and efficiency.

> No way anything kludged together by Ford or GM is going to compete.

> > The new model sells for 2.15 million yen ($18,430) in Japan, against
> > 2.18 million yen previously. The intelligent park assist system is
> > offered as an option, at an additional cost of 230,000 yen which
> > includes a DVD navigation system. Toyota has set itself a goal of
> > producing 300,000 of the eco-friendly hybrid vehicles a year by 2005
> > or 2006.

> Neat toy. :)  $2000 is a bit steep, though.

GM has actually been working on a parallel hybrid pickup truck for some
years now.  I'm surprised it hasn't hit the market yet, actually.  Of
course when I saw it it still had some issues to be worked out (as in
some fairly major components stopped working about 10 minutes before I
was scheduled to drive it, DOH! so I didn't get to play with any new
high tech toys :/)

nate

nate

<Gml..

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by <Gml.. » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 04:22:58



> > The new Prius five-seat passenger model is said by Toyota to be more
> > fuel-efficient and cheaper than its predecessors. Rivals General
> > Motors Corp and Ford Motor Co will launch their first hybrids later
> > this year.

> Lol.  Let's see - a Taurus or Coutour with a hybrid engine rushed
> and slapped into the chassis - exactly like the Honda "hybrid".  Ack.

> GM - nuff said.  Their EV-1 was a disaster.  Independant people
> had been converting normal Escorts and Metros to full electric
> for a decade or more and getting better speed and range - for
> less money.   (shakes head) Boggles your mind how badly they
> messed up - almost as if they were trying to make a hopelessly
> lowest common denominator vehicle to please some government requirement.

No, it was GM's way of saying, "Look Mr. California Government, we tried.
We did our best and this is the best electric vehicle we could come up with.
We've proven that your 10% fleet ZEV pollution standard is impossible to
attain with reasonable performance and range so you'll have to relax that
restriction."

It worked too.  From GM's position, the failure of the EV-1 was a victory.

It is still more suited to urban use than suburban or highway use.  The
Prius system is essentially a way to regenerate braking energy back into
acceleration.  Good for stop-and-go, but doesn't do much for places where
constant speed is held for much of the driving cycle.

I'm still waiting for a manufacturer to have the courage to build a hybrid
that is capable of operating as a pure electric vehicle for ranges of 10
miles or so while using an efficient constant-speed engine for greater
ranges.  That way you could operate in ZEV mode for urban trips while
retaining highway range.

Even the supposedly "refined" hybrids from Toyota and Honda are conventional
vehicles with motor/generators kludged into their drivetrains.  They carry
all the complexity of both electric and gasoline vehicles.  Nice for
proof-of-concept, but not really capable of realizing full hybrid potential.

BTW, The US has been building hybrid vehicles for many decades.  They are
called "diesel-electric locomotives"!  :)

George

Brandon Sommervill

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Brandon Sommervill » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 05:05:54



Being able to spot a 53' trailer isn't all that special.  They're kind
of hard to hide.  ;)
--
Brandon Sommerville
remove ".gov" to e-mail

Definition of "Lottery":
Millions of stupid people contributing
to make one stupid person look smart.

MelvinGib..

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by MelvinGib.. » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 06:54:25

From what I've read GM will have several hybrid trucks coming to
market soon.  If what I heard is true, it will be a NO COST
option.

mike hunt




> > > The new Prius five-seat passenger model is said by Toyota to be more
> > > fuel-efficient and cheaper than its predecessors. Rivals General
> > > Motors Corp and Ford Motor Co will launch their first hybrids later
> > > this year.

> > Lol.  Let's see - a Taurus or Coutour with a hybrid engine rushed
> > and slapped into the chassis - exactly like the Honda "hybrid".  Ack.

> > GM - nuff said.  Their EV-1 was a disaster.  Independant people
> > had been converting normal Escorts and Metros to full electric
> > for a decade or more and getting better speed and range - for
> > less money.   (shakes head) Boggles your mind how badly they
> > messed up - almost as if they were trying to make a hopelessly
> > lowest common denominator vehicle to please some government requirement.

> > Note - I have links somewhere to a Honda hatchback that was converted
> > for $30K and got a 250 mile range - back in the mid 90s.  Standard
> > little CR-X with some weight reduction and NI-MH batteries.  Nothing
> > purpose-built.

> > To me? - the new Prius looks nice.  Wait 2-3 years and get a nice one
> > for the price of a stripped Echo.  No kludge, either - a ground-up
> > design made to squeeze out every bit of performance and efficiency.

> > No way anything kludged together by Ford or GM is going to compete.

> > > The new model sells for 2.15 million yen ($18,430) in Japan, against
> > > 2.18 million yen previously. The intelligent park assist system is
> > > offered as an option, at an additional cost of 230,000 yen which
> > > includes a DVD navigation system. Toyota has set itself a goal of
> > > producing 300,000 of the eco-friendly hybrid vehicles a year by 2005
> > > or 2006.

> > Neat toy. :)  $2000 is a bit steep, though.

> GM has actually been working on a parallel hybrid pickup truck for some
> years now.  I'm surprised it hasn't hit the market yet, actually.  Of
> course when I saw it it still had some issues to be worked out (as in
> some fairly major components stopped working about 10 minutes before I
> was scheduled to drive it, DOH! so I didn't get to play with any new
> high tech toys :/)

> nate

> nate

Joseph Oberlande

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Joseph Oberlande » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 07:55:12





>>>The new Prius five-seat passenger model is said by Toyota to be more
>>>fuel-efficient and cheaper than its predecessors. Rivals General
>>>Motors Corp and Ford Motor Co will launch their first hybrids later
>>>this year.

>>Lol.  Let's see - a Taurus or Coutour with a hybrid engine rushed
>>and slapped into the chassis - exactly like the Honda "hybrid".  Ack.

>>GM - nuff said.  Their EV-1 was a disaster.  Independant people
>>had been converting normal Escorts and Metros to full electric
>>for a decade or more and getting better speed and range - for
>>less money.   (shakes head) Boggles your mind how badly they
>>messed up - almost as if they were trying to make a hopelessly
>>lowest common denominator vehicle to please some government requirement.

> No, it was GM's way of saying, "Look Mr. California Government, we tried.
> We did our best and this is the best electric vehicle we could come up with.
> We've proven that your 10% fleet ZEV pollution standard is impossible to
> attain with reasonable performance and range so you'll have to relax that
> restriction."

> It worked too.  From GM's position, the failure of the EV-1 was a victory.

Meanwhile people with 1980s Escorts that the slapped several deep
cycle marine lead-acid batteries in were getting 120 miles per charge.
$10K to convert the car.  This was in 1990.

GM as usual builds crap.  I hope the new Prius makes all of the others
sweat bullets as they can't sell them fast enough with gas over $2 a
gallon.  The toyota site for the U.S. now has a lot of concrete data
compared to a month ago - and it's all good.  $20K price and potential
tax rebates and incentives and...  Plus the power, room...

Why bother to get a Civic for $17-$18K?

Which is - gosh - I do 8-12K a year on my car.  70% city driving and
short commutes.  That's most of us in the U.S.

It will come.  Soon, in fact.

Heh.  And - guess what - they work and use a lot less fuel.

Philip

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Philip » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 10:32:25


> On Mon, 01 Sep 2003 16:21:03 GMT, "Philip?"

>> My wife learned how to parallel park using a small Massey Ferguson
>> tractor.  Once she got it in her head what to line up with, what
>> to aim for, and when to turn the wheel, she could spot
>> anything.... even a conventional with a 53' trailer.

> Being able to spot a 53' trailer isn't all that special.  They're
> kind of hard to hide.  ;)

"Spot" means to line up and back up squarely to a dock door.
--

   ~~Philip

"Never let school interfere
  with your education - Mark Twain"

Eddie Yas

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Eddie Yas » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 12:56:24





<SNIP....>

>>To me? - the new Prius looks nice.  Wait 2-3 years and get a nice one
>>for the price of a stripped Echo.  No kludge, either - a ground-up
>>design made to squeeze out every bit of performance and efficiency.

> It is still more suited to urban use than suburban or highway use.  The
> Prius system is essentially a way to regenerate braking energy back into
> acceleration.  Good for stop-and-go, but doesn't do much for places where
> constant speed is held for much of the driving cycle.

The Prius DOES improve things significantly when you're doing lots of
constant-speed driving:  I recently drove from Boston to North Carolina
and back in my Prius, and averaged 47.5 mpg.  This was going about 70mph
when the speed limit was 65 and about 75mph when the speed limit was 70
(which it was for several extended portions of the trip.)  That's about
25% better than the Echo's highway MPG rating of 38.

Also, in my day-to-day commuting from the suburbs of Boston to Boston,
which is about 50/50 urban/highway driving, I'm averaging slightly over
50 mpg (in the summer months.....this does drop to mid-to-low 40's in
deep winter.)

To my mind, at least, that makes the Prius quite suited to suburban or
highway use.  The increased mileage of the '04 (if it lives up to the
specs, that is) will only make it moreso.

In perusing Toyota's Japanese site for Prius, someone in one of the
Yahoo Toyota Prius groups saw some text that made it look like the
version released in Japan may have an option to run EV-only, though I
think that was from reading text run through Babel-fish, so who knows if
that's really the case.  But, it would be interesting if they're leading
up to that!

Well, this 'kludge' of Toyota's is providing me with mileage and low
emissions that I'm very happy to be taking advantage of *now*, rather
than waiting for future versions.  The improvements made between the
current Prius and the soon-to-be-released '04 certainly do make your
point that there's lots of unrealized potential yet to be explored in
the arena of hybrids.  Here's hoping they continue the trend!  :)

-Eddie

- Show quoted text -

Marc

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Marc » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 15:09:22


>It worked too.  From GM's position, the failure of the EV-1 was a victory.

They even planned for its failure.  Rather than support the vehicle, they
refused to sell them.  Instead, they only leased them so that they could
technically own all of them.  That way, when the leases are up, they can
take them all back and not have to support them.

If they wanted them to succeed, they'd have been trying to sell them, not
purposefully telling people they weren't allowed to have them and keeping
them from sale.

Evidently, GM plans for failure quite well.  I guess they have quite a
record to build upon.

Marc
For email, remove the first "y" of "whineryy"

Brandon Sommervill

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Brandon Sommervill » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 21:39:58




>> On Mon, 01 Sep 2003 16:21:03 GMT, "Philip?"

>>> My wife learned how to parallel park using a small Massey Ferguson
>>> tractor.  Once she got it in her head what to line up with, what
>>> to aim for, and when to turn the wheel, she could spot
>>> anything.... even a conventional with a 53' trailer.

>> Being able to spot a 53' trailer isn't all that special.  They're
>> kind of hard to hide.  ;)

>"Spot" means to line up and back up squarely to a dock door.

I figured as much, but it was too much for a layman to pass up.  :)
--
Brandon Sommerville
remove ".gov" to e-mail

Definition of "Lottery":
Millions of stupid people contributing
to make one stupid person look smart.

Matthew Russot

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Matthew Russot » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 22:30:51


>I'm still waiting for a manufacturer to have the courage to build a hybrid
>that is capable of operating as a pure electric vehicle for ranges of 10
>miles or so while using an efficient constant-speed engine for greater
>ranges.  That way you could operate in ZEV mode for urban trips while
>retaining highway range.

It's not a matter of "courage".  To do a serial hybrid as you describe
requires that you have an electric motor powerful enough to run the
whole car, plus a gasoline motor ALSO powerful enough to run the whole
car.

While I don't think the Prius and Insight systems are good
implementations, I can see why they are preferred over the serial
implementation.
--

"Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit
of justice is no virtue."  But extreme restriction of liberty in pursuit of
a modicum of security is a very expensive vice.

Matthew Russot

Car That Can Park Itself Put on Sale by Toyota

by Matthew Russot » Wed, 03 Sep 2003 22:32:20





>>My wife learned how to parallel park using a small Massey Ferguson
>>tractor.  Once she got it in her head what to line up with, what to
>>aim for, and when to turn the wheel, she could spot anything.... even
>>a conventional with a 53' trailer.

>Being able to spot a 53' trailer isn't all that special.  They're kind
>of hard to hide.  ;)

The trick is to distinguish the 53' trailer from the 48' trailer
without looking on the side for the "53'".
--

"Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit
of justice is no virtue."  But extreme restriction of liberty in pursuit of
a modicum of security is a very expensive vice.